<HTML>Jerry Unterman shifted the entire nature of the discussion. By denying the
greatness of the "avot" in favor of Eisav and Yishmael certain basic
issues have to be addressed. The Torah tells us very little regarding
Avraham before he was addressed by Hashem. Are we to assume that according
to "pshat" he was no different than anyone else of his generation and
revelation happened upon him randomly? Or are we to assume that even
before this event Avraham was the one singled out in his generation by
Hashem due to his beliefs and characteristics (though not mentioned
explicitly) and chosen as the father of Klal Yisrael.
According to the Torah the tradition continued through Yitzchak not
through Yishmael. Was this also a random selection unconnected to
individual qualities. Was Yitzchak merely a regular average guy born to
a great (if you accept the greatness of Avraham) father, and Hashem was
forced to address him by default.
Was it a role of the dice which caused Yaakov to be chosen over Eisav, or
perhaps he was selected because his deceit succeeded.
What is Bereishit? A collection of mythological tales which describe the
roots of the Jewish nation? A presentation which leaves more to fate
or immoral human action than to providence.
Assuming the greatness of the "avot", does not introduce new tenets of
faith. Nor does it stifle any independent thought in favor of the "only
one yeshiva" interpretation. However it does assume that the Torah is a
serious divine religious document based upon schar onesh and providence.
One can be sympathetic of Yishmael and Eisav, and critical of Sarah, Rivka
and Yaakov. However one cannot deny that they were chosen and achieved
divine revelation. Hence, one cannot deny their being far greater than
myself.
The above sets guidelines and parameters within which there is a lot of
room for various opinions. Within these parameters I can accept Jerry's
interpretation and be critical of Yaakov, albeit with caution. On the
other hand I can adopt the equally valid interpretation presented by H.
Zweiter. Rabbi Kosofsky also forwarded a reasonable approach. One need
not suspend one's intellect, instead one should apply it, thereby
accepting the fact and legitimacy of Yaakov's choseness.
Rav Yair Kahn</HTML>
